Can't really get too sorry for the Japanese.
The Penguin
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Letting off steam. You don't have to like it or agree with it, it is written for my benefit and no one else's. Feel free to add comments if you choose. There will be no moderation. If you choose to post personal attacks, I may well leave them there, so that the bile can fester in the sunshine of my approval, as I regard it from the vantage point of the moral highground.
30 comments:
Controversial, but a valid point.
Harsh, but fair.
CR.
Guaranteed you won't see THAT on the BBC...
Fair point. How something tastes seems to be the one and only consideration?
Harsh, and unfair. Firstly, you can't murder an animal, murder being a term in law applying to humans. Secondly, a hydrodynamic shape and a big brain doesn't infer civil rights. I don't agree with whaling. Fisheries were shamefully over-exploited by seafaring nations (not just Japan) to an extent that no other natural resource has ever suffered, but you're wrong to link Japanese fishery practices to this tragedy. Whales should be left alone, and hunting such intelligent animals is cruel; but that's my personal opinion, and it's not my place to tell the Japs what they can't catch in their own waters, or to infer that the deaths of men, women and children is somehow less than horrific because a few percent of their steaks come from the sea and not an abbatoir.
I think you'll find that the Japanese whaling fleet hunts all over the place not just in their own waters. And if it's perfectly OK what they do with regard to dolphins how come they go to such lengths to try and hide it?
Bet the Chinks are pissing themselves.
It's not OK but they keep it hidden for the same reason that you don't see lambs and pigs being killed, squealing piteously, when you go into a butchers'.
The whaling "fleet" is one ship, the Nisshin Maru 3. It kills about 1200 animals per year of different species, as distinct from tens of thousands per anuum killed by western nations before whaling became unpopular. Hopefully "The Cove" will change public opinion in Japan, but at the moment they have more important things to think about.
Anything capable of complex emotions, family bonds, problem-solving, bravery and self-sacrifice are worthy of respect, especially if they are our fellow human beings.
Yeah, right - they were especially "fellow human" in their treatment of prisoners of war and even civilians in the lands they had invaded during WW2. But I expect you'll have some excuse for that?
No, there was no excuse for mistreatment of POWs, but obvious chronological factors mean that the current Jap populace are not responsible, any more than than you and I are responsible for the political actions which forced Japan to go to war in the first place. (Remember Tony Blair apologising for slavery? It's self-indulgent bullshit to feel guilt or to apportion blame for historical misdeeds.) We agree that whaling is unethical. We probably also agree that taking orders on how to live your life from foreigners is unethical. A dichotomy, it would seem?
Go fuck yourself Penguin. I hope your family dies at the hands of a mad nigger rapist.
Agree with you wholeheartedly Penguin.
@Richard 'forced Japan to go to war in the first place' - whoa, whoa ho ho ho - stop right there, cease, desist, refrain, withdraw & retract. There's the minor details of the 'rape of Nanjing' and also Pearl Harbour, the fact that the Yanks were trying real fucking hard to stay out of it and the Japs thought they could inflict an instant strategic victory in the Pacific and shore up their expansionist ambitions.
I always thought Pearl Harbour was one of the most egregious acts of cowardice but fortunately the Battle of the Medway kicked arse.
But yeah, 70 years is a long time.
I can't retract. The US embargo forced Japan's hand; the attack on Pearl Harbour was not by any means cowardly (they didn't know if they were steaming to destruction and might easily have been) and the fact that it occurred before war was declared was not the Jap Navy's intention or fault.
I'm glad that they lost the war and accept that they were mostly brutal and inexcusably sadistic and deserved everything they got from the Allies, but the word "cowardice" has no business being applied to the Japanese in battle; for all their faults they were brave.
The Japanese behaviour prior to Pearl Harbour was hardly saintly - Nanking Massacre for example - and their use of slave labour and "comfort camps" completely disgraceful and even now not officially acknowledged or apologised for despite being well-documented and proven past all denial.
They sneak around the moratorium on commercial whaling with their smokescreen of scientific experiment and investigation, yet the whale carcasses don't end up in laboratories and no scientific papers are ever published.
That such destruction is visited upon them from the depths of the sea seems to me to be only appropriate.
They had destroyed Imperial China before FDR thought 'these fucks are psychos'. I see petulance & cowardice in the same vein.
Their troops used to run competitions with prizes for who bayonetted the most Chinks in a day. One man's embargo is another man's self preservation.
It is rumoured that, if you pick up a sea-shell in the Pacific Ocean today and put it to your ear, you can hear the sound of whales laughing......
Apparenty,"Fairy Liquid" have donated one million bottles of detergent to Japan .. after they heard that thousands were washing-up on the beaches ..
Penguin - you are right up to a point. The Japs shouldn't hunt whales and dolphins, and the Japanese Imperial Army richly deserved a hammering for their cruelty. We part company in that you seem to find some degree of serves-you-rightness in the drowning of men, women, children and babies just because you disagree with the Jap Government's fishery practices and the warcrime sins of their grandfathers. I remember when fish and chip shops used whale oil and tasty were the chips, but that doesn't mean that Britons at the time deserved to be drowned.
DTP - John Masters'book "the road past Madalay" is worth a read.
What Richard said x2 you have made a bit of a cunt of yourself Penguin when you equate animals with people. The Japanese have behaved disgracefully in the past, but we have plenty of examples in our history of unpleasant behaviour.. Are you going to apologise to the rest of the world for this? No? Thought not. Twat.
Infidel - Please help yourself to a full refund and don't bother coming back.
@Richard - I'm sure it is but if you're trying to equate a surprise bombing on the Yanks Pacific fleet with FDR's embargo (across the fucking Pacific - clue - it's fucking huge) as a casssus belli then, well, I think you've deviated from history into revisionist horseshit.
No 2 ways about it, the Nips dishonoroubly, cowardly and fortunately unsuccessfully declared war on the Yanks and rightly got fucked.
"You have made a bit of a cunt of yourself Penguin when you equate animals with people."
Infidel, you're the cunt by coming out with an arrogant statement like that. What ever theory of evolution you believe in, we all share the planet and its resources. But it's mankind who, despite claiming to be more "intelligent", is the species that's done far more damage in a few hundred years than anything other intelligent creatures like whales and dolphins have managed.
Twats like you make me think there is a good case for drastic de-population of the earth....
DTP - The book was Masters' personal account of commanding British soldiers against the Japanese, it's a good read. I don't know who's fault the war in the pacific was - probably the Japanese, as you say -but it certainly isn't logical to place the blame on dead Japanese of recent seismic events, or for their Government's two fingers to the IWC. That's the point. Wishing an entire populace drowned, or taking any satisfaction in widespread death, or saying "serves you right" - is it that far away from not giving a fuck if barbarians are beheaded? Microdave? "Twats like you make me think there is a good case for drastic de-population of the earth...."
A sentiment expressed by the Japanese in Nanjing, no doubt. It's this them-and-us mindset that leads to trouble, and it's generated in populations by the PTB for their own ends. You are a dangerous man.
If I'm a "dangerous man" then I have plenty of company in high places:
http://green-agenda.com/
I didn't blame the Japs for the earthquake, just got a bit arsey when you said the Nips were forced into war. And, just for boring records - the Burmese are utter cunts too. McArthur had the right idea - take out China, Korea & Burma straight after the nips but beltway pussies outranked him and then we walk straight into the Korean 'police action' (gotta love that), Indochine and then Vietnam with a few genocides along the way. Mao, Pol Pot, Laus etc etc whilst the Nips just sat back and laughed their fucking tits off. Fair play - well played Japan.
It's even vaguely arguable that had the US taken China, or at least subdued it without Chaing Kai-shek getting legitimacy, therefore pulling back Stalin and saving 100 million lives but who the fuck cares these days eh?
But, the bottom line is the Nips could have stayed the fuck out of WW2 if they were such cowardly, arrogant, mother fucking automaton cunts.
MD, that's the kind of callous bilge I was thinking of. Decreasing the "surplus population" and "the real enemy of man is man." All manner of shite to excuse elitist control via eugenics.
Ta for the link, BTW.
DTP, the Japanese were never cowards. Correct you may well be but that one statement is demonstrably false. If you've got a few minutes this article shows the calibre of the enemy as well as that of our own soldiers. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1168185/Revealed-The-terrible-suffering-extraordinary-courage-British-WW2-soldiers-fighting-Japanese-Burmese-jungle.html
Dear Mr Penguin
Sometimes, you've just got to doff your cap at fucking genius.
http://mrishmael.blogspot.com/
If you can't laugh, well, err....
Cheers DtP
one word...."karma"..
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